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An Imperial Guard Warhammer 40,000 Blog, with the occasional deviation.

Now with added NECRON!!
WARNING! Slight Warzone: Resurrection, after taste.

Monday 18 October 2010

Noooo! Why am I not learning!!!

Once again, my poor guys were slaughtered to a man. That man being the me.

For the battle report, well written as it is, have a look at Rorys disgusting blog here.

I couldnt do it. Too painful. He however was smiling with every word.

Problems? Well its always a fearful path when you lose a game, its very easy to think "If I had a chuck norris I could have won, maybe I should buy a chuck norris." Dangerous thinking. Especially when usually you lost because of bad luck/poor decisions.

Except now Im sure.

The average Imperial Guardsmen is very very human. He has a weapon which in all fairness is an insult. Though to be fair its more expensive then he is. Most Imperial Guard experts claim that the Imperial Guard use numbers to win the game. Think Operation Meat Shield.

Tried it. Dieded.

The average Space Marine is God in Warhammer 40,000. Conspiracy theorists and angry ex GW gamers (especially including the fundamentalist warmachine movement) claim that the company GW makes Space Marines super because sell the most. Maybe their right. But I wanted to look at the maths.

So.

Space Marine fires at a guardsmen.

  • BS of 4 means he must roll a 3+ to hit. So 2/3 odds.
  • S of a Boltgun is 4 against the IG's T of 3, means again 3+, 2/3 odds.
  • AP of a Boltgun is 5. Armour save of an IG is 5. Result is that the armour is negated.

Therefore. When a whole Tactical squad fires at a squad of guard:

  • 10 shots. 7 hit (rounding up). 3 Wound and kill.

This is under ideal conditions, ie, not in short rage, not including the cheaper special funky weapons of death like flamers and H.Bolters.

Now a IG fires.

  • BS of 3 means 4+ 50/50
  • S of a lasgun is 3, against the Space Marine T of 4 = 5+ . = 1/3
  • AP of a lasgun is -, ie, nuthin. Which means they will get their wopping save of 3+. Which means 2/3 of all succesful wounds get stopped.

That of coarse means on average a guard squad will do:

  • 10 shots. 5 hit. 2 wound. Most of the time all wounds being saved. = 0 wounds. Ah crap.

But what about special weapons? The ultimate levellers? Well for some reason, the Tactical squad can buy certain weapons for cheaper then the IG, most strangely the Plasma gun. Which admittidly is a bit wasted on guardsmen! But dangerous to the now completly nerfed Chaos Marine players. That though is not my problem. :D

Now out of the special weapons and Heavy Weapons, the SPace Marines can use about the same in their Tactical squads as the IG use in their infantry squads. Flamers, Heavy Bolters and such are really good at killing many things. However, although lascannons and meltaguns can kill space marines really good (if they hit!), plasma guns are the only viable counter to the space marines wopping 3+ save.

It seems to me that there is a large distance between the world of 4+ armour saves and 3+. Nearly all the weapons in warhammer 40,000 short of ordenance and planetary explosions do not take away that pesky of saves. Now, although weapons such as the Auto Cannon and Heavy bolter can wound them easily, that save will still stop those heavy caliber rounds 2/3rds of the time, after miraculously hitting and wounding. Not looking good is it?

But dont you get more Imperial Guardsmen then Space Marines? ANd what about Orders!?

Well, true, the Infantry Guardsmen only costs a meagre 5pts, while a Tactical marine costs a rather large 18pts.

So, lets take an average Tactical squad of 10 marines, with heavy bolter (which is free) and a flamer. That comes to around 200pts (rounding it up neatly).

For that value, we can take nearly a whole platoon of guardsmen, but we will leave some space for special weapons, which strangle again, cost more than the men carrying them:

  • Command section 30pts
  • Squad 50
  • Squad 50

=130pts, 70 for 4 plasma guns and a melta gun.

Okay.

Space marines fire at one squad at a time. Which is helpful. Opening up, they instantly kill 4 guardsmen. + 2 with Heavy Bolter.

Up close, this would be a massacre, as they rapid fire bolters and torch the whole squad.

Eg.

Flamer fires first, to better hit as many as possible. Presuming it coats five, average killing 2 or 3 outright.

8 Bolters rapid firing = 16 shots. 10 hit. 6 Wound and kill instantly.

Heavy Bolter, we presume ran so cannot fire.

Result = One Guardsmen left. Probably running for his life!

Imperial Guard Platoon get to fire first at long range:

30 Lasgun shots from entire platoon. 15 hit average. 5 wounding. 2 or 3 saving, killing around 2.

4 Plasma guns open up. 2 hit. Lets be generous and say that both wound, no saves.

Result is 4/5 dead.

Imagine short range firing!

So why doesnt this work in practice!?

  1. Scenery blocking massed firepower.
  2. Close Combat. (The bane of all guardsmen)
  3. Space Marines have a penchant for Rhino drop offs.
  4. Other units, Predator Destructors.

Excuses aside, most of the time its all about who fires first. Usually a Space Marine Tactical squad will destroy an entire unit of guard in one volley. While this doesnt exactly get him many points, the return fire is alreay stymied. Also, on a board not big enough to support all those teeming hundreds of men, scenery can be a real bitch.

Lesson here?

  • Dont spread out your guard. Concentrate the fire volleys into one squad at a time (that being the most deadly or best fit).
  • Avoid CQC as much as possible.
  • Use as many plasma guns as possible.
  • Do not rush forward into their guns, let them come to you and catch them in a short ranged volley.
  • If in doubt, use a Russ.

2 comments:

  1. As written on Rorys blogg, heres my reasons for losing so much. They are my excuses, and Im sticking with them!

    They say an artist shouldnt blame his tools. Well theyve obviously never tried to copy a picaso with a piece of brick and paint.

    The loss was huge. But, like nearly every game, the loser walks away with more to think about. What did I learn from this game? Especially a day on, after the vengeful rage has subsided.
    Well, I can sum up the cause for the disaster in three simple sections.

    Cause 1: The Player
    Unfortunatly, working for 48 hours before the game and having only 4 hours sleep did take its toll. Mistakes were made. Namely the forgetting of the Storm Troopers, whome I was forced to deploy as Deep Strikers. I would have preffered them setting up as either scouts or outflanking, better being able to stall and surprise. I cannot complain with what they managed to accomplished, but by golly they could have done so much more!
    Also, for some reason, I moved my men forward in the first turn, over eager to claim the objective and running straight into the fearful Space Marine Counter attack. The maths is clear, whoever gets to rapid fire first, usually hits hardest. What I did in that first turn was outright simplistic stupidity that can and did result in a horrible mess. Think two predators destructors firing all, two tactical squads (one rapid firing) and a razorback all pounding into my units.

    Cause 2: The Army
    While the Space Marines can utilise any weapon to better kill their foe, the Imperial Guard are running up hill. Not many weapons could be described as Space Marine killers (ie removing that infamous 3+ save). This means it comes down to fire efficiancy. Either lots of it, or lots of plasma and ordenance. I had neither.
    In many ways, my army was better suited to killing Orks or Eldar. ALso, what kind of IG army lacks a proper Leman Russ or three?
    The continuing choice of Basalisks has to stop also. The mobile artillary, now costing 125 pts is a waste at such range. Unable torely on armour, scenery or cheapness, its better suiting to huge boards where its indirect fire (now a compusary addition) is better suited.
    Indeed, removing those two walking basalisks and replacing them with one maybe two Leman RUsses changes the aspect of battle instantly. Armour 14 is not something to ignore. (Unless its Necrons...)

    Cause 3: The Other
    Unfortunatly the board size was smaller than normal, pushing the deployment to a meagre 7". this didnt cause to much of an issue until the lack of room to retreat came into the fold.

    Man of the match? Storm Trooper Squad, for executing the enemy general. Again. :D

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  2. for playing against marines i usally use plamsa guns in special weapons squad, but its the stupid gets hot thing that bother,s me.

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